Re: Extra Blacktown platform (was: St Leonards, NSW)

["Dave Proctor" <daproc@sd5.mailbank.com>]

Garry Hoddinett <hoddos@netspace.net.au> once again misses the point when he
writes in message 7uqrj8$1hte$1@otis.netspace.net.au">news:7uqrj8$1hte$1@otis.netspace.net.au...

> If Blacktown is inadequate for current and future needs then Hornsby is
to!
> A look at the current August 1999 CityRail timetables reveals the
following
> in the peak hours 7:00am to 8:00am:
>
> - Blacktown has 17 train departures to points east (City & Cumberland
Lines)
> and 2 through trains (The Fish and The Chips).
> - Blacktown has 9 trains arriving from points east, 2 starting services
for
> the Richmond line and 2 through (non stopping trains).
>
> - Hornsby has 18 train departures to points south (9 shore, 9 mainline)
> - Hornsby has 13 train arrivals from points south (6 mainline - including
> the XPT, and 7 from the north shore).

You cannot compare the two - they have totally different service
characteristics. Hornsby has car sheds just to the north - a train can sit
there until time, come into the platform, open doors, pour people on, close
doors and go.

There are also totally different operational characteristics. Hornsby is a
division of tracks in the up direction. Blacktown, on the other hand, is a
merger of lines in the up direction. Granted, the opposite applies in the
evening peak, where Hornsby becomes a merger in the dominant flow direction,
and Blacktown becomes a junction.

there are other things you failed to mention. Blacktown has a much larger
number of through services. Hornsby has a much larger number of services
starting and terminating at there. Blacktown has an extensive bus/rail
interchange, Hornsby has none.

You also fail to appreciate that you can not determine the number of
platforms required based purely on the number of services. There are other
factors to be considered. Station dwell times are a factor as well. Hornsby
has a lot of trains that are almost empty when going through in the morning
(due to the fact that they start at Hornsby). When a train is empty it loads
quicker.

Blacktown, on the other hand, has trains that are fairly full by the time
they get there, and this delays loading (some would say the ferals who live
in the area are a bit thick and contribute to the delays, but that is
another story). Blacktown also has signifigant numbers travelling to it - so
you are faced with a situation where people are trying to get off the train
at the same time as people are trying to get on. All of this contributes to
dwell times.

> It terms of trains services both stations are generally equal but Hornsby
> has more onerous to handle terminating services.

Blacktown has them as well. And what is so onerous about terminating
services? You close the doors and go up to the yard. All you need is a
station assistant to assist with checking the train is empty.

> Hornsby handles its
> services with four platforms but Blacktown has six platforms with another
> one being built.  Even if you add say, six additional Olympic Park
services
> then Hornsby Station still handles more trains per platform.

Because of the different service characteristics. It is not the sheer weight
of train numbers, it is the characteristics of the service that matter.

How about you go to Blacktown one morning, and spend say 90 minutes there,
and see how well it copes. It copes reasonably well, but it is at the limits
of its performance. I have spent 90 minutes at Hornsby in the morning peak,
and things flow a lot more smoothly at Hornsby.

> At Blacktown,If you assumed a typical off peak type arrangement with say
> nine trains per hour from points east and nine trains per hour to points
> east  and overlaid a 12 Olympic Park services per hour then Hornsby, at
its
> peak, still handles more trains per Platform even with only six platforms
at
> Blacktown.

Why are you comparing a "typical off peak type arrangement" with "Hornsby,
at its peak"?

> The inadequacy of Hornsby is seen by the fact that trains are regularly
> delayed getting into Hornsby.

That is an operational thing and is easily sorted with a few extra station
staff to help check terminating trains, and if they were to employ guards
with balls (to close the doors and get going, rather than waiting for people
running down the stairs to try and catch an already late train).

> Suburban trains and Outer Urban Tangaras are
> regularly held up in Hornsby station waiting for late running Interurban
> trains.

I am not familiar with the layout of Hornsby yard - is it possible to put a
train in a loop somewhere (thus clearing the platform) and when the
interurban goes, send the other train out behind it?

But, using your argument, it is not unusual at Blacktown for a train to be
heldon platform 3 waiting for a late running train from the Richmond line.
This then banks up trains on the Up Main behind it. So the problem applies
at both stations.

>When this happens trains bank up along the North Shore line, trains
> arrive late into the station and people miss train and bus connections.
> Delays at Hornsby also impact on the whole of Sector 3 as has already
> happened a number of times this year.

And delays at Blacktown impact on both Sector 2 AND 3 - late running
Cumberland trains have the potential to delay trains between Merrylands and
Campbelltown.

> The inadequacy of Hornsby to provide for the future was clearly
foreshadowed
> in the failed 1996 timetable when more trains were tabled through Hornsby
> and the station couldn't cope.

That whole timetable was a disaster. There were other places that could not
cope either. Hornsby was not the only one.

> Besides you miss the point - Hornsby is an illustration, there are
probably
> a number of other stations that have an inadequate number of platforms but
> Blacktown should not be one of them.

Blacktown IS one of them - and not just for the games either. Every time
there is something on at Olympic Park, and the high frequency service is
run, Blacktown will be inadequate. THAT will have an impact not only on
those attending the event, but on all Sector 2 AND 3 services as well.

--
DaveProctor
thadocta AT dingoblue.net.au