Re: re why ......

[Graeme <grimegrime@hotmailremove.com>]

In article <3A828849.4DEE326C@pnc.com.au>, mcreely@pnc.com.au says...
>  I  agree with you Rod it's halfwits like this(and am I being polite)who have
> kept the drivers position as it is it wasn't until NR first came along that you
> were able to move from state to state as a driver(except Pilbara
> region)without  having to start all over again.
> 
> As I have said before I have never understood with the amount of training and
> knowledge that is required to become a driver and maintain that qualification
> why it has never been recognised as a trade, something the union should have
> pushed for years ago(please I don't want to start a seperate argument about
> what unions do and don't do).
> 
> I can remember hearing years ago that a driver used to be held in the same
> esteem as a High School Principal or a Crown Sergeant of Police(not now, we are
> treated with contempt as any other blue collar worker is treated).
> 
> As I said before if this was this guys attitude to the job no wonder he bailed
> out(must have been all too much).
> 
> At least now Drivers can move from operator to operator and state to state(the
> only good thing to come out of deregulating the industry- I'll get a barage on
> that last statement).
> 
> Regards BEE EFF
> 
> 
> 
> "Rod [comtrain]" wrote:
> 
> > obviously Greg a moron would know...eh?
> > by the way, I have a military trunk overfilled with Classroom notes,
> > manuals, safeworking exams, appendixes, Diesel guides, Help manuals etc etc.
> > You are welcome to come and peruse them any time, although I doubt that a
> > moron would get much value out of any of this stuff! Then probably that is
> > what is wrong with Sydney's Electric Train System at this time...they want
> > to relax the job classification so that wages of $75000 can be 'moronised'
> > back to a comfortable $35000 or so. Guess what would happen to your trains
> > then?
> >
> > In Melbourne we got rid of guards pretty quickly. Guards were offered spots
> > in classes to learn how to drive trains and much to the Drivers disgust were
> > offered reduced classes, taking account of their experience[?].
> > My figures are a little bit flaky, but essentially very few guards actually
> > took up the option, most left the job, or remained in the traffic sector as
> > Signalmen, shunters and even gangers.
> > Of those that sat the entrance exams, less than 5% went on to Drive.
> > Of those that passed Drivers exams, only about 10 are still in the job .
> > V/Line spent millions getting rid of guards, and got very little out of it.
> > Sydney seems to be making a complete mess of it, as usual. They better pull
> > their fingers out real soon, before class action is taken against the
> > operators, by some angry Corporations, big and small, who are sick and tired
When I joined the job in the seventies the folklore at Dynon said that 
during one particular fight for better wages years before, the 
adjudicating arbitration judge had made a comment along the following 
lines in the hearing of all parties that he considered train drivers to 
be glorified tractor drivers.
This was of course considered a slur by that particular generation of 
drivers and quite likely helped instill an us against them feeling.
Still driving is driving,its not a trade,its not a profession.You can be 
good at the practical or you can be an instructor or foreman.
Its changed from the steam days when it was very much a mule job,when you 
really had to know your roads so you knew when to steam and when to roll.
Its changed from the times when drivers decided they did not want 
permanent fireman any longer (steam) to the transition period of the 
trainee engineman..ie Bloke comes in off the street does some class work 
sits on his bum for 4 years and maybe has some good mates who teach him 
the finer points of driving a diesel, passes another test,some more class 
 work,and eventually gets his ticket and with a little luck stays out of 
trouble and gets on with it,till to today where class room theory and 
simulators teach the basics.
Its funny, I've seen drivers leave Vicrail go to the Pilbara for a few 
years as a driver, come back and fail to get back into driving, and end 
up picking up brake blokes in the yard.
I've worked with dangerous drivers who should never have been allowed to 
drive trains,and others that where permanently scared shitless every time 
they had to drive a passenger train.I've worked with guards who could 
drive trains as well as any goods roster driver.
But most guards never wanted to be drivers,they where traffic and happy 
and the driver was rolling stock and doing the steering.
Most drivers got on well with the guard and vicaversa,(out of each others 
hearing)....they where a team.
In my time "the guard was the brain at the back of the train,hope to 
Christ he stays there"
I would imagine the drivers job has got alot more lonely these 
days,seeing as so many other grades no longer exist between point A and 
point B.