Re: [Melb] New trams have few seats [was Batchelor says W-class trams to be back asap

["Ted Gay" <tedgay@bigpond.com>]

"David McLoughlin" <davemcl@NO***damned***SPAMiprolink.co.nz> wrote in
message 3a60f68d@news.iprolink.co.nz">news:3a60f68d@news.iprolink.co.nz...
> Vaughan Williams wrote:
> >
> > > I even tried to tell them that the new Citadis and Combino trams will
> > > have fewer seats than even a Z despite being much bigger, and they
> > > didn't see the newsworthiness of that either. Even the five-section
> > > Combino Swantson Trams is getting will have about 20 fewer seats than
> > a B despite being longer.
> >
> > I talked to Swanston about this (after finding out from you) and warned
> > the DPT. They vehemently denied it, saying that with the four
> > wheelchair bays they had the same number of seats.
> >
> > Do you have any detailed specs on these, preferably in paper form? I
> > asked Swanston for them but they haven't sent them and I don't think
> > they will.
>
> Yes, a friend in Austria who posts here at times (Wolfgang Auer) sent me
> the specs for the Melbourne Combinos from the German professional city
> transport magazine Stadtverkehr, which reproduces Siemens material. It
> has drawings with measurements/specs for both the three-section and
> five-section Melbourne order that shows the seat layout. There are 28
> seats in the three-section one and 56 seats in the five-section one. The
> reason for so few seats from looking at these drawings, is that there
> are a lot of very wide doors on both sides of the tram, so not much room
> for seats.
>
> These trams are designed for European cities which have short routes
> with heavy loadings, and also usually turning loops so the trams are
> single ended and only have doors down one side, rather than for a city
> like Melbourne which has very long routes, with no turning loops, and
> thus trams need doors on both sides, yet the traffic demands a greater
> requirement for more seats than in Europe.
>
> A few of the seats in the five-section version are 4+4 but most are 2+2
> or sideways-facing (longitudinal like in the saloons of the W2s).
>
> There are no 4+4s in the three-section version at all.
>
> Please email me your postal address (remove the spambuster in my address
> up top) and I will send you a copy of this document. It's in German
> (which I can read okay) but you will have no problem with the scale
> drawings if you can't read German.
>
> David McLoughlin
> Auckland New Zealand

Here in Sydney we have Melbourne built 5 section ADtranz trams with 74
seats, 68 plus 6 tip-up seats in the wheelchair spaces. Only three doors per
side, there are times when I wish the trams had more doors.  It's a crazy
world we live in.

Ted