On Mon, 20 Mar 2000 00:50:27 GMT, G.Lambert@unsw.edu.au (Geoff Lambert) wrote: >...All very arbitrary of course. People "came up" to London in >Isaac Newton's time, I believe. > Isaac Newton's time, indeed! Try: "today." This is so completely tied in with the origin of "up" and "down" railway lines that any other use of the terms in other countries is confusing to strangers. Don G