Re: Melbourne Double deckers

["Sunshine Cat" <Ellen316@yahoo.com>]

i can say go transit is pretty damn good
Graeme wrote in message <3820e94d$0$21318@motown.iinet.net.au>...
>Richard,
>
>Thanks for your response.  Because of the huge urbanisation of Australian
>cities including Melbourne, it is important that regional centres like
>Frankston have express services.  To shift the focus away from peak period
>services serving just Melbourne, here in Perth we run our expresses away
>from Perth as well as to Perth.  By running through trains as well say and
>I'm only guessing Broadmeadows to Melbourne then through to Frankston with
>the train being limited stop on both sides, you start to promote cross city
>travel.  You also don't have to be a rocket scientist to also work out that
>running expresses contra flow also gets the equipment back into the City
for
>a second or even third trip in the peak.  In Perth we use 46 of 48 two car
>sets a number running as four cars in the peak to uplift 110,000 passengers
>per day.  Lots of the fleet is running 18 hours per day continuously
because
>with a high capital intensive system labour becomes a lower cost
>consideration.  With longer distance through limited stop trains as we have
>in Perth, we know people who are commuting across town for up to 60
>kilometres taking 45 minutes to do so using our system.
>
>All trains hub in Perth so that passengers can interchange freely and in
the
>off peak connections are guaranteed.  All systems including the overseas
>ones you mention have an "on-time" factor that includes running up to three
>minutes late (but still shown as on-time).  We developed our performance
>criteria from the Kowloon to Canton (KCR) together with GO Transit in
Canada
>who use the same spec.
>
>What I found without being too critical is that Melbourne is a difficult
>system to use.  In Perth our captive patronage i.e. those who have no other
>transport options is less than 2%.  We have to have a user friendly service
>because if not 98% of passengers can travel some other way.  In fact in our
>early days with the system we had a couple of glitches and that showed in
>the following days patronage figures.  Similarly in Perth we get flooded
>with passengers on the Northern Suburbs line if the freeway has fowled up
>for more than two days in a row!!!  (I often wondered about rostering staff
>to breakdown on the freeway to help build our business)!!!  It didn't
really
>matter.  ^ weeks after we opened the line in 1993, building on all that we
>had learnt from the other lines, certain time periods in the peak hour were
>carry loadings not planned for until 2020!!!
>
>--
>Graeme Vellacott
>PO Box 322
>CANNINGTON 6987
>AUSTRALIA
>Email:   gvrail@thatsent.com.au
>Ph/Fax: +61 8 9451 5630
>Richard <richard_snook@primus.com.au> wrote in message
>3820DD04.20DDD5C9@primus.com.au">news:3820DD04.20DDD5C9@primus.com.au...
>> Graeme
>>
>> Intersting stuff. I agrre that the fundamnetal cornerstone of
revitalising
>the
>> sytem (and in this case I'LL refer to Melb) is to start afresh...totally
>rethink
>> what the service is need ed for and how it is to do it....you can  modify
>an
>> existing system only so much before it cracks.  Im sure that the gurus
>> designing  these systems never use them, you sir seem to be the
exception.
>> Im sure for example that there could be arguements for ruuning certain
>trains as
>> ultra expresses...say for example on the Frankston line run totally
>express
>> from Cheltenham...right up til it hits the loop..there may be cause for
>two of
>> these....radical eh...those wishing a train to facilitate a change at Sth
>Yarra
>> of Richmond would baord a conventional express...by my calc thats 8-9
mins
>off
>> thetrip...providing correct "windows". Of course the whole system could
be
>> looked upon in ths view. I appreciate the bottlenecks that exist...but Im
>sure a
>> canny "engineering-analyst " group could find the answer..
>> To me the eseential error that most of these "systems" make is to say
that
>for
>> arguement sake a train is on time if within 3 mins...to me a train is on
>time if
>> its on time..otherwise it is late..I accept reality but if we accept 3
>mins
>> thenwe are 3 mins behind the 8 ball.. ibelieve the germans, french ,
>italians
>> and japanese, probably many others wotk to the idea that a train is only
>on time
>> if its on time. that swhere we should start.. You cant cut headways down
>if
>> forever allowing for the reality of 3 mins for starters and then the
>inevitable
>> lateness of situations.
>> It has to be as you incurred out West a complete mindset and culture
>change.
>> This may well be where the new franchisees get their "ptential "
>improvements
>> from.
>> Did you take the standoint that you are running a service for passengers
>as
>> opposed to running trains for the system??
>>
>> Cheers >:~)) Richard
>>
>> Graeme wrote:
>>
>> > Re Melbourne System
>> > Increased frequency and keeping current sized consists is the way to
go.
>In
>> > 1990 in the lead up to rail electrification customer surveys of users
>but
>> > most importantly non users of the system put frequency and reliability
>ahead
>> > of everything else.  Speed but consistent on time performance was also
a
>> > factor and here we designed the "skip" stopping pattern where in the
>peak
>> > period every train becomes a limited stop train with major stations
>having
>> > every train stop and "minor" stations every alternate train.
>> >
>> > Frequencies are two trains per 15" for the Armadale, Fremantle and
>Midland
>> > lines.  Minor stations get a train every 15".  Skip stopping plus rail
>> > electrification reduced travelling times by up to 30%!!!  Customers
>through
>> > away their timetables as frequencies increased and in the off-peak
>services
>> > run every 15" on regular clock face timetables!!!  On the Currambine
>Line
>> > opened in 1993 peak hour frequencies are every 3 minutes and every
>alternate
>> > train is an express!!!  Off peak trains run every 7.5 minutes.
>> >
>> > Melbourne could easily go this same path improving utilisation of
>equipment
>> > and boosting frequency and capacity.  The change in operating culture
is
>> > enormous.  We threw everything out and started again!!!  Maintenance of
>> > equipment both rollingstock, signalling and infrastructure has to be
>> > meticulous.  Each day we run 765 timetabled services of which 98% must
>run
>> > within 3 minutes of schedule.  New customers flooded the system proving
>that
>> > what the customer was asking for would give us the result!!!
>> >
>> > How do I know???  I was the General Manager equivalent at the time and
I
>> > used to ride the system frequently!!!!
>>
>
>