Re: [VIC? NSW?] OT - doubling efficiency/frequent service

["Hubert Lam" <hubert@imap4.com>]

"Michael" <usenet.spam@gunzel.net> wrote in message
news:9093CEFAEgunzelT333@203.164.20.149...
> hubert@imap4.com (Hubert Lam) wrote in
> <9cj67t$h25$1@tomahawk.unsw.edu.au>:
>
> If public transport was run as a service and not for a profit, then cost
> wouln't be an issue. People prefer a more frequent service. As an example,
> when train frequencies on Sundays in Melbourne went from 40 minutes to 20
> minutes, patronage also went up with it. People don't like waiting.
>

Somehow Arthur Smith must learn how to timetable correctly...first of all,
it's a big sin to run 4 car trains on the weekend nowadays. More and more
people are using the Sydney rail system to get around, and also on weekends.
I've discovered that whenever there is track upgrading on the weekend, the
trains that run on the [whatever remains of] line affected are at least 6
cars. However when there is NO track upgrading, they go back to the miserly
4 car T sets. Also the current timetable has been built on something that
was created almost 10 years ago. Over the past 10 years the % increase in
the number of trains that are timetabled to run has not matched the %
increase in patronage...(probbaly due to "loss-reduction" strategies)

> Where do all the extra bus passengers come from? The cars that are
> competing with the bus in the first place. Filling up one bus can take up
> to 40-60 cars off the road. Quite a bit of extra space for the bus to
> operate.

I'll give some STA Sydney examples where double decks could run, with the
same frequency maintained and be able to rack up more revenue:

288 Epping -- QVB
400 Burwood/Eastgardens -- Bondi Junction
L90 Palm Beach -- Railway Square
426/428 Tempe/Dulwich Hill -- Circular Quay
394/L94/X94 La Perouse -- Circular Quay
393 La Perouse -- Railway Square
372 Coogee -- Railway Square
891/895 UNSW -- Railway Square
470 Lilyfield -- Circular Quay (I don't think the introduction of Metro
Light Rail has not affected patronage)
438/L38 Abbotsford -- Circular Quay
500 Ryde -- Circular Quay
520/L20 Parramatta -- Circular Quay
380 North Bondi/Bondi Junction -- Circular Quay

also for Westbus, their M2 Hills--City buses.

>
> >However on some routes the frequency can be doubled without such
> >effects, whilst having no requirement for double decks to be used...
>
> Double decking often requires a whole lot of infrastructure upgrades that
> can be achieved for a lot less by simply operating a higher frequency.
Back
> in Melbourne, we found out, the costly way, that double deck trains
weren't
> the solution, hence we are stuck with one 4D set.

A lot of Sydney's arterial roads already meet the 4.4m clearance requirement
(sorry, had to reduce it from 4.7m, because I remembered there are no dbl
decks higher than 4.4 these days) . I think even the Harbour Bridge will fit
a double decker in quite nicely, despite its age.

>
> Anyway, that is only part of the solution... Buses need to be integrated
by
> means of both services and fares with other public transport systems, like
> trains, trams, and ferries.

Of course, there's no bleeding point running a double decker every hour when
you can run two single deckers every half hour. If Sydney ever grows large
enough, what I would like to see is a rail system that is less integrated
(eg. not having 5 "lines" running from Strathfield to Central, and 3 "lines"
from Sydenham to Central via Redfern). Then you can start thinking about
train services every few minutes (start the InterCity trains from places
like Hornsby, Sutherland, Blacktown etc). Combine it with a good quality bus
service (in general, STA is very good) the only thing will be praise and not
whinge.

>
> MK.
>
> --
> To email me, just remove ".spam" or else your reply gets directed to the
> bit bucket.
>
> Never engage in an intellectual argument with an idiot.
> They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience --
> (Unknown)